Who Gives A Fish Forums

Posted: **Thu Jan 27, 2022 11:09 pm**

shakinStevens wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 5:40 pm
LacieB wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 10:53 am I've always run my tanks with CO2, but not consistently, and I've had decent results with low-light plants. My nitrate levels are usually around 40 ppm, and I do a monthly water change. My fish are thriving, and the anubias seems to love it.

I'm having some trouble getting my 29-gallon tank's nitrates below 40 ppm - I did a 50% water change last night, so we'll see if that helps. My 55-gallon tank is at 10 ppm, and the hex tank is doing fine, but I'm not really sure what's going on with that one.

From what I've learned, plants need nitrates to grow. I'm not looking to break the bank on plant food, but I do have some muriated potash lying around - I'm thinking of adding a small amount to my 55. I've also got Activate and Envy for my plants, and I recently picked up Flourish Excel, but I haven't used it yet.

So, what do you guys use for plant fertilization? I'm looking for something that'll work with my sketchy CO2 setup - I've got a 20 lb canister for keeping SHB out of my Lioneycomb, but it's not exactly designed for indoor use. I've also got relatively low nitrates and low light, so any suggestions would be appreciated.
This is actually not correct. Plants need Nitrogen (N), not nitrates (NO3). However, potassium nitrate is the easiest to find and is less toxic than ammonia or nitrite. So many fertilizers use it. One alternative is Urea, CO(NH2)2.

I've used it in my tank successfully. I've also read of others using it successfully. My understanding is that seichem nitrogen is mostly Urea with some KNO3. But there is a hazard that it could convert to ammonia. I haven't seen that in my aquarium. Possibly because the plants consumed the ammonia before I ever noticed it.

If you have measurable nitrate, you might not need to add it for plants. Is the nitrate coming from your fish or tap water?

Considering your post, LacieB, I'd say be cautious with adding just one nutrient, like Potassium. Plants will use the potassium and the other nutrients in the water, then stop growing because of multiple deficiencies. You need all the nutrients.

A cost-effective way is to only use the amount necessary. Anything over what's needed is wastefully spent. For a 55-gallon tank to achieve 10ppm NO3, you need about 3.3 grams of KNO3. A one-pound bag of KNO3 costs about $4 on a mail-order site. That's enough for 151 10ppm doses done once at each water change. That's enough for seven years. The best way to dose a fertilizer is to use a fertilizer calculator to determine how much to add and then measure it out and add it.

If you buy a liquid fertilizer, you'll end up spending a lot of money for mostly water, and there's no guarantee the company is making a good product that will work in your tank.

Another way is to use the waste from your fish to fertilize the water. This involves fewer water changes, so fish waste builds up to allow plant growth. However, this involves some risk since stuff other than plant nutrients can build up and become toxic. This has been used in larger tanks like your 55-gallon but is difficult to do in smaller tanks.

You might want to try a floating plant first, like Salvinia or red root floaters. If these grow without evidence of a nutrient deficiency, like yellow or damaged leaves, you might already have enough nutrients for some plants. If the plants don't look good, it might be possible to figure out what nutrient is missing and adjust for that.

At this point, it all depends on what you want to do. But there isn't enough information in your post about what you want.

I just tested my tap water for nitrates, and it's a big fat zero. So all the nitrates in my tank are courtesy of my fish. I've got way more plants than fish in my little 29 now, after I removed the neptunes - mollies were eating the babies, and nitrates were through the roof at 80 in early June. Cutting the population and stepping up water changes has made a big difference.

Posted: **Fri Jan 28, 2022 12:43 am**

There's a difference between adding fertilizers for plants and the creation of ammonia and nitrate in aquariums. Plants do need nitrogen, and ammonia is created in tanks by fish exhaling and pooping, as well as by the breaking down of organic matter like fish food and dead plant leaves.

Aquatic plants can get the nitrogen they need from the ammonium that most ammonia becomes in water. They can also use the nitrogen in nitrate, and even in urea if it's added to the tank. However, when it comes to any ammonia/ammonium/nitrate being made available in a tank, the plants will use the ammonium, not the ammonia, while the bacteria will use the ammonia.

When plants use ammonium, the end result is nitrate, and if they need to use it, they'll do so. However, they have to convert it back to ammonia, which means it supplies less energy for the plant. I've come across some research that suggests a few aquatic plants prefer nitrate as their nitrogen source.

Take Salvinia natans, for example. In one study, plants supplied with only nitrate had lower growth rates, shorter roots, and smaller leaves with less chlorophyll than plants supplied with ammonium alone or in combination with nitrate. Ammonium was the preferred form of nitrogen taken up by the plants.

This makes sense, given that plants need to expend energy to convert nitrate back to ammonia in order to use it. This means that nitrate provides less energy to most plants.

Posted: **Fri Jan 28, 2022 3:11 am**

LacieB wrote: ↑Thu Jan 27, 2022 10:53 am I've always run my tanks with CO2, but not consistently, and I've had decent results with low-light plants. My nitrate levels are usually around 40 ppm, and I do a monthly water change. My fish are thriving, and the anubias seems to love it.

I'm having some trouble getting my 29-gallon tank's nitrates below 40 ppm - I did a 50% water change last night, so we'll see if that helps. My 55-gallon tank is at 10 ppm, and the hex tank is doing fine, but I'm not really sure what's going on with that one.

From what I've learned, plants need nitrates to grow. I'm not looking to break the bank on plant food, but I do have some muriated potash lying around - I'm thinking of adding a small amount to my 55. I've also got Activate and Envy for my plants, and I recently picked up Flourish Excel, but I haven't used it yet.

So, what do you guys use for plant fertilization? I'm looking for something that'll work with my sketchy CO2 setup - I've got a 20 lb canister for keeping SHB out of my Lioneycomb, but it's not exactly designed for indoor use. I've also got relatively low nitrates and low light, so any suggestions would be appreciated.

If your fish are producing most of the nitrate, you likely also have high phosphate levels. Consider getting a phosphate test kit.

Aquatic plants require several key nutrients: nitrogen (N), potassium (K), calcium (Ca), magnesium (Mg), phosphorus (P), sulfur (S), and chlorine (Cl). I checked the water quality report for Fort Worth, Texas, and it appears your Ca, Mg, S, and Cl levels are fine. Mg levels might be a bit low, but I wouldn't add it unless a magnesium deficiency is suspected. Generally, I aim for 1 ppm P and 5 ppm Mg. Epsom salt (Magnesium Sulfate) is commonly used. Some people with high fish loads report needing extra potassium. If you need it, you can use potassium sulfate or potassium chloride. I'd try 5 ppm. Use a fertilizer calculator to determine how much to add to reach these targets. You can get most of these ingredients at LoudWolf.com.

If your plants don't do well with the above information, you might need to dose some micros. Micro nutrients include iron (Fe), manganese (Mn), boron (B), zinc (Zn), copper (Cu), molybdenum (Mo), and nickel (Ni). Nickel and molybdenum are the least used nutrients, and 0.001 ppm is sufficient. You might already have enough of these from your tap water or fish waste. If your home has copper pipes, you likely have enough copper in your tap water. Iron is often deficient in many tanks. Fe DTPA is the best iron fertilizer, and it's stable up to a pH of about 8. For micros, dose to the following levels: Fe 0.1 ppm, Mn 0.05 ppm, B 0.02 ppm, Zn 0.02 ppm, and Cu 0.006 ppm. Due to your high kH, all but B should be chelated nutrients, like Fe DTPA, Mn EDTA, Zn EDTA, and Cu EDTA. These are typically found at hydroponics stores in 1lb minimum quantities, so they might be more expensive. For B, use boric acid, but you might not need this one – your fish might be producing enough.

Posted: **Fri Jan 28, 2022 3:29 am**

I was thinking I need to get a phosphate test, but I'm not sure which one to get - the old Red Sea tests seem to be gone. I've heard the Salifert one can be a bit tricky to use, I tried one before and it was a pain. Has anyone had any luck with the API phosphate test? When I do my monthly water changes, my pH is usually around 7.5 in the tanks. If I switch to larger or more frequent water changes, my fish seem to adjust to a pH of 8 pretty quickly. That being said, it's not ideal for breeding corydoras or albino bristle nose, so I'm trying to find a balance.

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Zeroing in on nitrate-free plant food: what are your options?

Re: Zeroing in on nitrate-free plant food: what are your options?

Re: Zeroing in on nitrate-free plant food: what are your options?

Re: Zeroing in on nitrate-free plant food: what are your options?

Re: Zeroing in on nitrate-free plant food: what are your options?