identifying cichlids and determining tank size

[armorbay]

Hey everyone,

I'm planning to give my 325L/85.5g tank a makeover, changing it from its current setup to something similar to the picture I've seen. I'd love some help identifying the cichlids in the photo and maybe even a rough estimate of the tank size.

Edit: Just a guess from a total cichlid newbie like me, but I'm thinking:

Demasoni Cichlid Pseudotropheus sp. Demasoni (Pombo Rocks)
Red Zebra
Powder Blue

[willie32]

Hi, I'm also working on an Mbuna tank right now. I agree with your ID, but I'll give you the updated scientific names since Malawi cichlids can be tricky to research due to the constant name changes. The striped ones are likely Chindongo Demasoni - not necessarily from Pombo Rocks, as they're commonly tank-bred. The pale blue ones could be Chindongo Socolofi or Metriaclima Callainos, while the orange ones are probably Red Zebras, Metriaclima Estherae. Alternatively, the orange ones might be female Metriaclima Msobo Magunga, with the male being the black and blue fish above them.

For a tank your size, consider having four 'slots', each with one male and 4-7 females. However, I'm not a fan of the species mix in the picture. Demasoni can be quite aggressive, and having two Chindongo or two Metriaclima species doesn't sit well with me. You could achieve a similar look with just two species - Chindongo Saulosi, which has black and blue striped males and yellow/orange females, and Metriaclima Callainos. I'd suggest three male Saulosi and one male Callainos, with four females for each male Saulosi and five for the Estherae.

I initially planned a mixed species tank in my 75 but decided on a single species tank with Metriaclima Msobo Magunga. I love the unique males and bright orange females. My plan is three males and 12 females, but I might add a small group of Socolofi - one male and four females. If you choose to keep multiple males of the same species, always have at least three.

[armorbay]

Hi, I'm also working on an Mbuna tank right now. I agree with your ID, but I'll give you the updated scientific names since Malawi cichlids can be tricky to research due to the constant name changes. The striped ones are likely Chindongo Demasoni - not necessarily from Pombo Rocks, as they're commonly tank-bred. The pale blue ones could be Chindongo Socolofi or Metriaclima Callainos, while the orange ones are probably Red Zebras, Metriaclima Estherae. Alternatively, the orange ones might be female Metriaclima Msobo Magunga, with the male being the black and blue fish above them.

For a tank your size, consider having four 'slots', each with one male and 4-7 females. However, I'm not a fan of the species mix in the picture. Demasoni can be quite aggressive, and having two Chindongo or two Metriaclima species doesn't sit well with me. You could achieve a similar look with just two species - Chindongo Saulosi, which has black and blue striped males and yellow/orange females, and Metriaclima Callainos. I'd suggest three male Saulosi and one male Callainos, with four females for each male Saulosi and five for the Estherae.

I initially planned a mixed species tank in my 75 but decided on a single species tank with Metriaclima Msobo Magunga. I love the unique males and bright orange females. My plan is three males and 12 females, but I might add a small group of Socolofi - one male and four females. If you choose to keep multiple males of the same species, always have at least three.

Thanks so much for the detailed info @willie32, I really appreciate it. I didn't think about the potential issues with having two Chindongo or Metriaclima species in the same tank, that's really helpful to know.

So, if I'm understanding you correctly, I'd set up my tank with four 'slots' or groups of fish. Here's what I was thinking:

I'd have one group of Chindongo saulosi with 3 males and 12 females, and then another group of the same species, but with just 1 male and 4-5 females. I'd also have another group of Chindongo saulosi with 1 male and 4 females. And then for the fourth group, I'd have Metriaclima Callainos (also known as Maylandia?) with 1 male and 5 females.

Do you have any other suggestions for cichlid species that would work well and look great in a setup like this? For example, if I swapped out the third group with a different species, what would you recommend?

[willie32]

Hey everyone,

I'm planning to give my 325L/85.5g tank a makeover, changing it from its current setup to something similar to the picture I've seen. I'd love some help identifying the cichlids in the photo and maybe even a rough estimate of the tank size.

Edit: Just a guess from a total cichlid newbie like me, but I'm thinking:

Demasoni Cichlid Pseudotropheus sp. Demasoni (Pombo Rocks)
Red Zebra
Powder Blue

No problem, when it comes to mixing the groups it's not an exact science as the groupings are a bit confusing but the more you can diversify the look of each species - stripes, colours, headshapes - it helps dilute aggression in a tank. I've found it's worth trying to keep up to date with the names as they're constantly being updated and refined. Chindongo replaces a lot of Pseudotropheus and Metriaclima are often ex Maylandia species but also take in some Pseudotropheus, Pseudotropheus seems to be a big bucket species name before they get reclassified.

One of the advantages of choosing only one of each family is it helps cut down the risk of hybrids but still remember that all mbuna can hybridize so you need to have a plan to control breeding - a group of Synodontis catfish usually do the trick.

I think its a typo but just to clarify on slot one of your list it would be 1m 4f not 3 and 12.

If you wanted to do more than 2 species I'd go for 4 different species but you would only have one vertically striped fish with the male Saulosi and the yellow females would fill an other niche. If you kept the Callainos as your Metriaclima/Maylandia species that would give you the solid bright blue. I'd then be tempted by something like White Tailed Acei for a purple/indigo body with white fins or Mainganio for horizontal black and blue bars - you might need a bigger group of these. Rusties might be a good option - lavender bodies and bronzy top and bottom.

A Labeotropheus species might be possible but not for everyone with their funny faces, quite a big fish too so you really have to be into them to keep them as they take over the tank visually in some respects. Some people do say that you can mixed solid coloured and striped Metriaclima so I'm wondering about Kawanga Golds which are vertical black and yellow stripes - but then could they clash with the striped Chindongo Saulosi.

Its an interesting puzzle to work out what you'll be happy with, what gives the best coverage of colours and patterns and whats most likely to thrive in each others company - the last point being the most important.

A good mix would be 5 Chindongo Saulosi, 5 Metriaclima Callainos, 5 Pseudotrophus sp. Acei Ngara and 8 Melanochromis sp. Maingaino. That gives you loads of colours, the Maingaino are probably the most aggressive but meant to be ok in higher numbers and they are monomorphic so males and females look very similar. The Acei should live in the top third, females are a bit more drab but not much in it, the Callainos are kind of the same, and you get the great dimorphic look of the Saulosi. No real heavy hitters in there, 4 males to spread aggression and enough fish in total to make sure no one fish should get too much grief at any one time.

[armorbay]

Hi, I'm also working on an Mbuna tank right now. I agree with your ID, but I'll give you the updated scientific names since Malawi cichlids can be tricky to research due to the constant name changes. The striped ones are likely Chindongo Demasoni - not necessarily from Pombo Rocks, as they're commonly tank-bred. The pale blue ones could be Chindongo Socolofi or Metriaclima Callainos, while the orange ones are probably Red Zebras, Metriaclima Estherae. Alternatively, the orange ones might be female Metriaclima Msobo Magunga, with the male being the black and blue fish above them.

For a tank your size, consider having four 'slots', each with one male and 4-7 females. However, I'm not a fan of the species mix in the picture. Demasoni can be quite aggressive, and having two Chindongo or two Metriaclima species doesn't sit well with me. You could achieve a similar look with just two species - Chindongo Saulosi, which has black and blue striped males and yellow/orange females, and Metriaclima Callainos. I'd suggest three male Saulosi and one male Callainos, with four females for each male Saulosi and five for the Estherae.

I initially planned a mixed species tank in my 75 but decided on a single species tank with Metriaclima Msobo Magunga. I love the unique males and bright orange females. My plan is three males and 12 females, but I might add a small group of Socolofi - one male and four females. If you choose to keep multiple males of the same species, always have at least three.

That's a really cool idea you've got there. I'm curious, how do you think Labeotropheus trewavasea would fit in, personality-wise, instead of the Pseudotropheus sp. Acei Ngara? I think the darker blue/black colors would be covered nicely by the Melanochromis sp. Tangazo already.

In terms of the different types staying in specific areas of the tank, I'm not sure if they really stick to one spot or just swim all around the rocks all the time. Do you think they just kind of occupy their own little niches, or is it more of a free-for-all?

[willie32]

Hey everyone,

I'm planning to give my 325L/85.5g tank a makeover, changing it from its current setup to something similar to the picture I've seen. I'd love some help identifying the cichlids in the photo and maybe even a rough estimate of the tank size.

Edit: Just a guess from a total cichlid newbie like me, but I'm thinking:

Demasoni Cichlid Pseudotropheus sp. Demasoni (Pombo Rocks)
Red Zebra
Powder Blue

I can see why you'd like the Trewavasea, but the bright blue body might clash with the Callainos - it's not a guaranteed issue, but there are other options to consider. There's another Labeotropheus species with red bodies and blue/white fins, I'm just blanking on the name right now. What about Rusties, Iodotropheus Sprengerae? They're pretty different from the others, smaller than the Labeotropheus, and a bit more predictable in terms of their behavior.

As for the different species' behaviors, most Mbuna tend to stick around the rocks, but some do differ. Acei species, for example, are often found higher up in the water column, and they tend to live in large groups around the shoreline in rocks and wood. Labidochromis species are a bit different too - they venture out more than most Mbuna and sometimes swim in the open water. I wouldn't recommend yellow labs for this tank, but what about white labs? They'd introduce a nice new color and some different behavior - just be careful with the strain of Callainos you get, as some of them can have a bit of white in them. OB Callainos are another option, and they look really cool.

[armorbay]

Hi, I'm also working on an Mbuna tank right now. I agree with your ID, but I'll give you the updated scientific names since Malawi cichlids can be tricky to research due to the constant name changes. The striped ones are likely Chindongo Demasoni - not necessarily from Pombo Rocks, as they're commonly tank-bred. The pale blue ones could be Chindongo Socolofi or Metriaclima Callainos, while the orange ones are probably Red Zebras, Metriaclima Estherae. Alternatively, the orange ones might be female Metriaclima Msobo Magunga, with the male being the black and blue fish above them.

For a tank your size, consider having four 'slots', each with one male and 4-7 females. However, I'm not a fan of the species mix in the picture. Demasoni can be quite aggressive, and having two Chindongo or two Metriaclima species doesn't sit well with me. You could achieve a similar look with just two species - Chindongo Saulosi, which has black and blue striped males and yellow/orange females, and Metriaclima Callainos. I'd suggest three male Saulosi and one male Callainos, with four females for each male Saulosi and five for the Estherae.

I initially planned a mixed species tank in my 75 but decided on a single species tank with Metriaclima Msobo Magunga. I love the unique males and bright orange females. My plan is three males and 12 females, but I might add a small group of Socolofi - one male and four females. If you choose to keep multiple males of the same species, always have at least three.

I'm absolutely loving the rusties now that I've seen them, I was unable to find them before as I didn't have the full name for them, but they look incredibly beautiful.

You're introducing so many amazing ideas here, willie32, I have to rethink my original thoughts. I actually think that the Saulosi might have to go, and make space for some of the others.

The white labs ( Labidochromis caeruleus (Nkhata Bay)?) looks stunning, and they would look magnificent with the Pseudotrophus sp. Acei Ngara I believe. The OB variation is Orange Blotch, correct? I've read that the OB variation can be found in the Metriaclima Caillanos and a bunch of other varieties (benetos, emmiltos and estherae to name a few?) and they really do look cool.

This OB Red Zebra Metriaclima Estherae is pretty stunning and would also contrast very well with the Pseudotrophus sp. Acei Ngara and the Melanochromis sp. Maingaino.

If the Pseudotrophus sp. Acei Ngara generally swims higher in the water column, or at least venture upwards, would the following be feasible:

4 Pseudotrophus sp. Acei Ngara - 1 male 4 female
4 Metriaclima Estherae - 1 male 4 female
4 White Labs - 1 male 4 female
8 Melanochromis sp. Maingaino - 2 male 8 female

[willie32]

I hadn't thought of how Acei Ngara and White Labs would look together, but yeah, that's a great combination. Your 4 groups would work really nicely, I love Mbuna tanks that manage to get a Lab and an Acei species in there - you get some different behaviors from them too.

There are lots of different strains of Estherae worth checking out, one of them has orange females and blue males which could be a nice feature in this mix.

The OB thing is really fascinating, it's not just a name, it's a natural thing that happens in Mbuna. It's from a period in their history where their patterns didn't replicate exactly as you'd expect in a stable species. Sometimes a female fish will throw out fry with a gene that means they present as orange blotch, it's quite subtle but other times it's really unexpected like that one you shared. If you get an OB male from that female, they can then start to pass it on if you breed from them, but it's not guaranteed.

[armorbay]

Hi, I'm also working on an Mbuna tank right now. I agree with your ID, but I'll give you the updated scientific names since Malawi cichlids can be tricky to research due to the constant name changes. The striped ones are likely Chindongo Demasoni - not necessarily from Pombo Rocks, as they're commonly tank-bred. The pale blue ones could be Chindongo Socolofi or Metriaclima Callainos, while the orange ones are probably Red Zebras, Metriaclima Estherae. Alternatively, the orange ones might be female Metriaclima Msobo Magunga, with the male being the black and blue fish above them.

For a tank your size, consider having four 'slots', each with one male and 4-7 females. However, I'm not a fan of the species mix in the picture. Demasoni can be quite aggressive, and having two Chindongo or two Metriaclima species doesn't sit well with me. You could achieve a similar look with just two species - Chindongo Saulosi, which has black and blue striped males and yellow/orange females, and Metriaclima Callainos. I'd suggest three male Saulosi and one male Callainos, with four females for each male Saulosi and five for the Estherae.

I initially planned a mixed species tank in my 75 but decided on a single species tank with Metriaclima Msobo Magunga. I love the unique males and bright orange females. My plan is three males and 12 females, but I might add a small group of Socolofi - one male and four females. If you choose to keep multiple males of the same species, always have at least three.

I've been doing a ton of research on Danish websites, and also some other online forums like this one, but I've also been reading the book "Cichlids of Lake Malawi" by Ad Konings - I think that's a pretty solid resource for learning about these amazing fish.

[willie32]

Hey everyone,

I'm planning to give my 325L/85.5g tank a makeover, changing it from its current setup to something similar to the picture I've seen. I'd love some help identifying the cichlids in the photo and maybe even a rough estimate of the tank size.

Edit: Just a guess from a total cichlid newbie like me, but I'm thinking:

Demasoni Cichlid Pseudotropheus sp. Demasoni (Pombo Rocks)
Red Zebra
Powder Blue

Honestly, it's quite challenging to find reliable advice on Malawi cichlids, but I've managed to gather some valuable insights from a handful of YouTube channels and the Cichlid Forum, which has some excellent articles and profiles. Someone on the forum shared the 4 slots advice and warned against similarities, which really resonated with me.

To be frank, it's taking some time to fully grasp the concept, but I'm planning to implement what I've shared above. The Malawi side of the hobby can be quite murky, with many people keeping them in questionable setups and claiming they're fine. My approach is to group them in as natural groups as possible and identify potential caveats to ensure the most success – for instance, avoiding similar-looking fish, maintaining good gender ratios, and having a plan for fry control.